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Discussion Starter #1
With the new F150 making the swap to aluminium construction in the name of weight savings, RAM is coming out and singing a different tune.

Chrysler’s Ram brand won’t be using aluminum bodies for its fullsize pickups anytime soon, in contrast with Ford’s announcement that the next-generation F-150 will utilize the lightweight material, a top executive says.

Based on our analysis, we feel steel is stronger, safer and more durable than aluminum,” Reid Bigland, president and CEO of Chrysler Group’s Ram truck brand, tells WardsAuto in an interview at the North American International Auto Show here. “The difficult thing with lightweighting is what the tradeoff is.”
so really they're only looking at things like the hood and tailgate, not much to be saved there. Really I think its damage control. The RAM is too new to be redesigned immediately. Stop gap statements until a real answer can be delivered.


Ram Chief Downplays Aluminum Use in Fullsize Pickups | Vehicles & Technology content from WardsAuto
 

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I wonder if the new F-150 will suffer in crash test rating because of the use of aluminum.

Even if the aluminum is a good move for Ford, obviously Ram is going to take the chance to talk about the other side of the issue.

I'll wait for some crash testing before I judge one way or the other.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
I wonder if the new F-150 will suffer in crash test rating because of the use of aluminum.

Even if the aluminum is a good move for Ford, obviously Ram is going to take the chance to talk about the other side of the issue.

I'll wait for some crash testing before I judge one way or the other.
its not like its made out of tinfoil. You want to know how aluminium holds up in crash testing, go look at the Audi A7, its chassis is all aluminium as well as a bunch of body pieces i believe.

You're in a pickup, you always win :D
 

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Thats right, also it's not just about the metal but also how they formed it and the tech they used to built it to what ever strength they need it for.

It's not like we're dealing with paper LOL
 

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This topic is kind of 2 way

They are right that regular steel is strong than aluminum

It's also easier to fix.

You can use aluminum in things like panels,hoods, brackets, gates,etc. That usually shaves off some weight. I'm not sure if regular aluminum is strong enough for things like subframes and control arms - especially in a truck.

Of course there is forged aluminum.. But we all know how expensive that can be.
 

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This topic is kind of 2 way

They are right that regular steel is strong than aluminum

It's also easier to fix.

You can use aluminum in things like panels,hoods, brackets, gates,etc. That usually shaves off some weight. I'm not sure if regular aluminum is strong enough for things like subframes and control arms - especially in a truck.

Of course there is forged aluminum.. But we all know how expensive that can be.
I agree with that. ideally you want stronger metals to make up the structure and key things based around the vehicles structure.
We'll just have to see how things go over time.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
This topic is kind of 2 way

They are right that regular steel is strong than aluminum

It's also easier to fix.

You can use aluminum in things like panels,hoods, brackets, gates,etc. That usually shaves off some weight. I'm not sure if regular aluminum is strong enough for things like subframes and control arms - especially in a truck.

Of course there is forged aluminum.. But we all know how expensive that can be.
yes i believe it is all forged aluminium, and you;re right it is a costly investment. I believe that is one of the biggest factors in ford wanting to expand their aluminium cpabilities. It looks like the next edge/MKX will be constructed from aluminium like the F150, so as they scale up the amount of vehicles making use of the material it will bring the cost down...
 

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Military grade, aluminum alloy--not being a chemist...I guess that's forged aluminum.

"Ford says there is still steel in the frame, which it calls "all-new" with "more high-strength steel than ever." The company says that its new "military-grade, aluminum alloys" used in Hummers and Bradleys improve "dent and ding resistance," in addition to saving weight."
 

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How I see it, Ford has a rep to live up to. There's no way they will sabotage themselves and make a crap product. I'm looking forward to this, but they need to provide more info on it to restore peoples faith in the idea.
 

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fixing aluminum is near impossible. you are better off replacing the panel

aluminum doesnt bend back like steel does. at least not easily and not without consequences.

just ask paintless dent removal guys about aluminum - they will give you an earfull.
 

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Discussion Starter #14
but all the companies know what a huge step this is. Have you seen some of the other comments from GM and Chrysler?

Bob Lee, who is in charge of powertrains for the Chrysler Group, called the new Ford truck “an interesting step in this evolution” toward the 2025 CAFE rules. With the high take rate on the V6 Ecoboost engine and the new lighter F-150, Ford’s pickup trucks may be “CAFE neutral” or even “CAFE positive”, meaning they won’t need some sort of high mileage vehicle in the lineup to offset pickup trucks’ usual relatively poor gas mileage when calculating corporate average fuel economy. Lee acknowledged that right now Ford’s use of the lightweight alloy is a major advance, ”I think when we look back, in retrospect, this will be a very noticeable step,”
Ford is saying the new 150 is CAFE positive.

t the GMC Canyon reveal, GM global product chief Mark Reuss was asked if he was afraid of the new development in the most important vehicle segment to the domestic automakers. “Am I scared? That’s a different word,” he said while acknowledging “concern”. He pointed out that the recently introduced Silverado/Sierra trucks weigh 200 lbs less than the ones they replaced, without needing to use aluminum
Its a real game changer, it will be interesting to see how the other 2 cope. Silvy/Sierra is going to get OLd and FAST. we should be seeing a new RAM shortly while the GM boys still have an entire product life cycel to live through before being able to address the weight issue...
 

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it will definitely be interesting to see how the competition catches up to what Ram is doing. Ford seems to be on Ram with it's rumored future offerings.
 

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I heard that the aluminum frame is less safe and will therefore rise insurance costs on people who end up buying the vehicle. So you may save money on fuel but you will just give that money to an insurance company instead of a oil company.
 

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There are many grades of steel just like how there are many grades of aluminum and many grades of carbon fiber and plastics.

I think in the future aluminum will start to be more widely used but for the mean time steel is still the most commonly used material for the body and frame.

Maybe in 2060 we will have carbon fiber chassis tubs for our Ram 1500s.
 

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They could also mix the materials, reinforcing them with other stronger ones.

2060 is too far away. Im sure it will happen MUCH sooner than that, maybe 2030?
 

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I wonder if tension those arms take is as good or better than the last, being part of the suspension system it's good to question this
 
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